To Hate or Not to Hate Tauriel …

27th Dezember 2014

Image Credit: James Fisher via Entertainment Weekly

… that is the question! For many people, there seems to be an easy answer. There’s so much hating out there, it makes me sick to my stomach, especially since some people just can’t distinguish between Tauriel, a fictional character, and Evangeline Lilly, an actual person who breathed life into said character because that’s her job as an actress. Seriously, people, what the hell is wrong with you?! If you’re in for a Tauriel witch hunt, fine, suit yourself. Just keep Evangeline out of it. For what it’s worth, she did a bloody brilliant job. It’s not her fault that the material she had to work with turned the whole thing into a mess.

So, what about myself? Do I hate Tauriel? Well, sort of. And then again, not really. Confused much? Yes, that’s also how I felt when I turned the whole issue over in my mind and came to the conclusion that Tauriel is innocent of all charges. In fact, she is the victim; has been abused and badly mistreated, ultimately becoming the most irritating character in the Middle-earth movie franchise. Wondering what the hell I’m talking about? Well, it’s not Tauriel herself that bothers me, it is how she was handled.

There are a number of characters that weren’t in the book that were included in the movies, probably because they already appeared in the Lord of the Rings trilogy and were supposed to draw people back into the theatres. While most of these characters were around at that time and meddled behind the scenes, there are also cases of characters that didn’t have much of an impact or were even dead long before the beginning of The Hobbit. Do I mind them being included in the movies? Not at all, although some could have had a little less screen time in favour of the actual Hobbit story.

And then there’s Tauriel. Tauriel does not exist in Tolkien’s works – at least, there’s no elf by her name although there are of course more elves around than the handful that is named. Therefore, her character isn’t that farfetched at all. Still, when I first learned about her, I wasn’t thrilled. Not because I suddenly turned into a diehard Tolkien purist and couldn’t handle an additional elf with a story arc. Not because I suddenly turned anti-feministic. It’s no secret that Tolkien’s works have a dire lack in female characters that get to do something other than just looking pretty, so yay for every single one that turns up – no matter whether they were actually Tolkien’s creations or invented by PJ & Co. No, I was wary because I suspected ulterior motives. And unfortunately, I would be proven right.

Nonetheless, when I saw the first pictures of Tauriel, I got my hopes up. Could it be possible that this lowly Captain of the Guards was just the badass warrior chick I wanted her to be? Then the first rumours spread that would crush my hopes into a million tiny pieces: Tauriel would be part of a love story. First, the other half was said to be Legolas. I didn’t like that at all. Then, it was said to be Kili. Kili, one of my favourites, and a dwarf at that. I couldn’t, didn’t want to believe a single word. Saying I loathed the sole idea is an understatement. As it turns out, it was even worse: a love triangle. The worst plot device ever invented. The character of Tauriel, the badass warrior, was reduced to nothing more than the love interest. Let’s just hold a minute of silence to commemorate the coldblooded destruction of a character that could have been an amazing addition to Middle-earth.

I liked Tauriel, the warrior. Her prowess with a bow, her stubbornness, her open-mindedness. She may have been young in years, but she could see much farther than most. She saw that evil forces were lurking in the dark, growing to be a danger to every living creature. She saw the necessity to step out of their confined picture-perfect world to fight against this evil, to make an impact. But all her wonderful character traits were overshadowed when she was forced into that ludicrous love story. If at least it had been somewhat believable, but no, it was insta-love at its best. They’ve know each other for what? A month? Let’s not even talk about the amount of time they actually spend in each other’s company. That would be along the lines of half an hour, max. Granted, in the book it takes Bilbo a couple of weeks to get the dwarves out; in the film, however, not so much. But hey, who cares?! „[I]t was real!“ This line made me break into hysteric laughter. You can’t imagine how much I rolled my eyes and wanted to hit my head repeatedly against the next best hard object in annoyed desperation throughout the movies.

Tauriel was degraded to a plot device: the love interest, inclusive love triangle and insta-love – I think it cannot get any worse. Apparently, it’s just not possible to make a big blockbuster movie without a love story and if the source material doesn’t provide any, then why not invent something so farfetched it will surely enrage the loyal Tolkien fanbase? Did none of the writers stop for one second and look at what monster they were creating, a female character that fulfils about every cliché imaginable, the warrior turned into a lovesick, totally irrational teenager? Do female characters really have no other purpose than falling head over heels for some male character and cause mayhem? Why do you even need a love story at all? If your sole purpose is to draw in the non-geeky girls, then let me tell you this is not how it works. Even if I were a non-geeky girl only watching movies that feature a love story, I wouldn’t go to see a movie, let alone three, in which the love story has a screen time of about 5%. If a friend would drag me into it, would these 5% better my opinion of these movies? I don’t think so – especially not, if the love story is so unbelievable.

Implying that women need a love story or else they are not interested is on the same level as labelling books/shows with “a female version of …”. Don’t even let me get started on how mad those labels make me implying that someone wants to dictate what I can or can’t read or watch and what I will like or dislike. I want to read and watch the good stuff, whatever that may be. I don’t need a watered down version of anything. Therefore, I don’t want to see a gorgeous talented elf warrior act like an irrational lovesick teenager. I want to see women I can identify with, I can look up to. It’s simple, really. How would you like me to advertise your film to my non-geeky friends if asked about the main female character? I could have told them that there’s a totally awesome female warrior elf who kicks some major asses. I will tell them that said warrior chick is unfortunately the greatest imaginable annoyance because she fell for a classic case of insta-love, which took so much of the emotional impact I wanted the movie to have on me away. Does that sound like something that’s going to convince my friends to go and see the movies? I don’t think so.

To Tauriel, I give my heartfelt sympathy. I’m so sorry. You deserved so much better.

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21 responses

  • Ahhhh, you express perfectly how I feel about the whole Tauriel situation and how badly the character has been treated. There was so much potential and then they ruin it completely with the damn stupid, unnecessary love story. And it’s not even ‚just‘ Tauriels portrayal in the movie that suffers, but also Kilis. His relationship with Fili, which was so great in the first movie, is completely lost, because it is more important that Kili and Tauriel throw languishing glances at each other for what seems to be at least a third oh the whole movie while Legolas watches them both angrily >. <

    • That’s so true! I really missed the whole Fili-Kili-Thorin dynamics and the ending of the book. That would have been such an epic scene. I was prepared to cry my eyes out and had been looking forward to those scenes but instead there was Tauriel and she got me so annoyed, I didn’t shed a single tear for that Kili scene in the end. She really ruined that for me.

      • Amen to that. I fully agree. For 3 movies each longer then 2 hours you’d expect more Thorin/Fili/Kili moments so their end would have more impact. Only now we see why they never had those moments, because even if they did their end still would not make impact because of the terrible way they reached their end in the movie version. That combined with the terrible way they made and treated Tauriel ruined a big chunk of the movies for me. (As a person who cries very quickly, like in give me a sad commercial and I cry in less then 10 seconds kinda fast, I did not cry for either Fili or Kili because it was done so poorly. I wanted to cry allright, for the injustice done to them. I was hoping for a scene AT LEAST as powerull as Boromir’s end. Even hoping for something even better because there where 3. 2 of which got a lot of screen time (Also angry at the little Fili screen time we got.)

        The movies would have been perfect if only 4 things where changed.
        1 More Thorin/Fili/Kili moments and loyal to book ending for them.
        2 Kick ass Captain of the Guard Tauriel (WITHOUD THE ROMANCE/Triangle crap)
        3 Tauriel not being impossible (as in only 600 years old and acting in a way not fitting for such a high function, her being a warrior AND a healer, her having red her (a minor thing I could have ignored had everything else been done well)
        4 Legolas being his good old younger self, and not this grumpyfied version so we are forced to believe fun legolas is thanks to her. It’s not. I refuse to let an oc be the reasons a canon character is how he is. Just no.

        Had Tauriel been 6000 instead of 600 and been a strong kick ass captain of the guard who acts in a believable way for her function withoud any instand romance with the hot dwarf crap, I would have loved her so much. (which also bothers me. If they HAVE to do a dwarf elf romance that goes against everything tolkien, then at least do it right and pick a dwarf that ..like you know..actually looks like a dwarf? Now it’s like the message is : Only pretty people fall in love and girls only fall for hot guys……)

        Had they used all that Kili Tauriel screen time for Tauriel being bad ass and for Kili/Fili and Fili/Thorin and Thorin/Kil I’d have been so much more happy.

        Also the way they changed Legolas so that Tauriel could “effect“ him also bothers me a huge deal. they should have made Tauriel and Legolas bro’s/close friends. With some fun bantering or sweet friend like gestures (like Legolas Aragorn, or Legolas Gimli or like you know any person Legolas is friends with…so we can see it’s the same guy..yeah). Grumpy Legolas botherd me. Because that makes no sense with how he is in lord of the rings (and I REFUSE to believe he became that fun version because of Tauriel. He IS that fun version because of himself. Oc’s did not contribute to that. Thats insulting to Tolkien, making up a character and then letting that character take all the credit for an actual real Tolkien character….that is just so not ok on so many levels.

        And if they had avoided the whole triangle thing, all of that would not have happend.

        So yeah, more Durin interaction and family feels, Legolas being his good old uh younger self, him and Tauriel being friends in an easy normal there is nothing else there way, and Tauriel being a BELIEVABLE Bamf kick ass older (3000+) female warrior captain of the guards elf withoud the romance. And These movies would have been awesome. I don’t even care about all the other things added or removed. I’d stop complaining about cgi Azog (or him even being there) the lack of Beorn, the dwarves vs smaug scene and all those otehr things I’m not fond off. But I could forgive them all if only they had not ruined Tauriel’s character, and in a way legolas character, and in a way Kili chances to have scenes with Fili and or Thorin instead)

        (they could even have added some romance, as long as it was not with Tauriel. They could have done so with some oc human and Bard. Him finding new love after his deceased wife would have made a more mature more believable and less over the top instand love at first sight romeo and juliet kinda cliche. Because bard’s first focus would be his kids and ..you know, killing a dragon? Oh and helping his people not starve or freeze, oh and getting the riches promised and needed for his people’s survival. SO a little bit of romance could have added to his character like all these things do but it would just be a small part of his character. Better fit in my opinion. I would also have been fine with some dwarf/dwarf romance. I have yet to see a female dwarf on screen. A lady with a beard. I want one, on screen, now! Dis where are you?

        Hell even Dis romance would have been cool. In the same way as Bard. Dis could find new love (if the movie would go with dead father for Fili and Kili), maybe in Dwalin or some other member of Thorin’s company. Give us beautifull flashbacks in the first 2 movies. Give us a reunion in the 3rd movie, let her fight along her kin there, and then have her be so happy Dwalin (or other dwarf) lived and then let her find out the fate of her boys and brother and show her grief/rage/dispair and then Dwalin (other dwarf) who shares the feelings try to keep her together and hold her. Instand tear jerkers.

        I am not against romance. When done right and believable. Bard x other human female ok Dis x other dwarf ok Even thorin’s company dwarf x oc dwarf would have been better.

        I find it annoying, that when they say the hobbit has to many males characters so lets add a woman, that when most of these male characters are dwarves, they think adding a female Elf is the solution in the first place. We have female elves. 2 of the 3 importand woman in LOTR are elves. It would have been great to have seen a female dwarf for once. (Or like you know, not another elf)

        Maybe they simply didn’t want to add small hairy woman? because they aren’t pretty and only pretty people can find love? (Because yeah, thats probably what the woman they added was a pretty she-elf, and the dwarf they used for the romance the only one who does not look like a dwarf at all (Fili has the dwarf hair style and the nose, Thorin did have a beard in the flash back so we can guess he cuts it short for some symbolic reason and would grow it back in erabor) Kili has like…nothing except being short..and even then is one of the taller ones. His face, his hair style is all more ranger/human like then dwarf.

        But by their logic an elf woman could simply NOT not be in love and just be kick ass because they are pretty so of course they need pretty men for romance, and a dwarf woman could simply not be part of a romance or be a role model because she would be to “ugly“ having facial hair, and a normal dwarf looking male could never be in a romance because again, to ugly..Like what?..

        Tauriel/Kili is not only terrible cliche/badly written/does not make any sense tolkien wise, and kills the potential of what could have been an awesome she elf, it’s also pretty insulting and yes here it comes, SEXIST.

        It would have been less sexist to have left her out completely then the way they did.

        She is NOT a good role model. And their romance leaves a very bad taste in my mouth for more reasons then just the usual “It’s not true to tolkien“ which is also a valid reason.
        But that they did not use a female dwarf with a beard instead, or a male dwarf who looks like an actual dwarf, gives a very bad image to girls and boys alike. It adds to the we need to be pretty to succeed stuff. Which is bullshit.

        End of rant 😛

      • Wow, thanks for those comments of epic length! (And I’m totally with you in the crying department.)

        I also didn’t cry for Fili or Kili. I was stunned how poorly Fili’s death was handled. They brushed over it so quickly just to give us that annoying Tauriel/Kili scene – for which I couldn’t cry for obvious reasons. I wish their death scene would have been more like it was hinted at in the book. Both fighting for Thorin, then one watching the other one die and jumping in to avenge him, dying side by side and Thorin fighting mad with grief until his own end. I can totally see how that scene would have played out on screen.

        As for the middle part of your comment – well, there’s nothing to add at all. My thoughts exactly!

        I wouldn’t have minded if there had been no romance at all. It’s not really that necessary, although I wouldn’t mind if it was done well. Probably everything would have been better than what we got in the end. And yet, it would have taken away or altered screen time from what I actually wanted to see. I just don’t get why there had to be an elf-dwarf-love-story at all! It’s just so against Tolkien canon that I can’t see why they had to do it at all.

        I’m not totally sure, but weren’t there female dwarves in that prologue when dale was destroyed? Well, just for a couple of seconds, but I thought there were some. It would have been great to see more of them, though. An oc dwarf lady would have been so cool! I mean, this is a fantasy world plus, they can’t tell me that even a ‚hairy‘ woman can’t look drop dead gorgeous. I mean, The only real difference is that they have a beard, but if I remember correctly from the diaries, the designs for female dwarves weren’t that hairy at all.

        True, true, true! Objectification at it’s best. Plus, how they portrayed her as that pretty irrational lovesick teenager, just as I wrote above. That so not a woman I want to or can identify with or look up to.

  • I don’t hate Tauriel but the stupid love story between her and Kili. If she had been just an elf next to Legolas, that would have been fine. But I think that the love story is unneccessary and stupid. I was glad that it wasn’t such a major part in the last film anymore. „Desolation of Smaug“ was really bad. In the Tolkien universe (at least how I understand it) elves and dwarves don’t like each other, categorically. Look at Lord of the Rings when it takes quite a long time until Legolas and Gimli become friends and trust each other. Nonetheless there’s always this rivalry between them (counting kills).
    But in the love story the different races don’t seem to be a problem at all. They never question that one is an elf and the other one a dwarf. This I really hated.
    Besides that I think Evangeline Lily did a good job as kick assing Tauriel.

    • Seems like we’re on the same page here, although I find the love story much more prominent and annoying in the last movie. In the second one, I was still hoping that Tauriel’s just curious. Yes, she already started to act lovestruck, but she wasn’t completely unreasonable.
      That’s the thing. This whole stupid mess takes so much away from Legolas and Gimli’s friendship. That was something special, something extraordinary. Now it also looks like Legolas only hated dwarves because Tauriel chose Kili and not because elves categorically hate dwarves and vice versa. The worst part was Thranduil acknowledging it. That made me soooo mad and it was totally out of character.

      • Agreed. One of the major reasons I dislike Tauriel/Kili so much (next to it being unbelievable and cliche) is how it takes away specialness of 2 relationships in Lord of the rings.

        1 Gimli legolas friendship = they where the ones awesome enough to get passed their dwarf elf differences and build a lasting friendship with eachother. This was a big deal. It adds to what makes their characters so special. Now it indeed feels like A) Legolas hates dwarves because he wasn’t chosen or B) He becomes friends with Gimli because Tauriel showed him how it’s done…both rubb me the wrong way. Tauriel is on oc, and an oc should not get the credit for an actual true Tolkien character. Gimli and Legolas did this huge thing, and they should get full credit for this.
        2 Arwen Aragorn = Interspecie love is supposed to be very rare. Especialy when concerning elves. That was why her and Aragorn where such a big deal. tauriel/Kili not only makes it seem less rare/special, it even overshadows it because Dwarf/Elf is a much bigger deal then human/elf.

        Both the Arwen Aragorn Romance and the Legolas Gimli friendship suffer because of this. And these 4 characters and their relationships (who are much better written and much more believable) deserve to get the full attention.

        They did not stop and think what the Tauriel/Kili thing would mean to the following movies. they just added it because they thought some random romeo juliet romance would be fun to add. except this is not Romeo Juliet. Its not a competition which movies have the most extreme relationships. It’s a tale about a Hobbit named Bilbo. And Thorin and Gandalf play huge parts. Their bad romance distracts and takes time away from the story that needs telling.

        I love most of the hobbit movies, but that part has not only ruined the them for me regardless, but even the lord of the rings movies as well. I am trying to unsee the Tauriel/Kili romance in my headcanon and try to filter those scenes out and replace them with worthy scenes so I can still watch lord of the rings and be awed by how cool Gimli and Legolas are for being the FIRST in generations time to cross the bridge between their species. And swoon with the beautifull fairy tail romantic but not over the top romance of Arwen and Aragorn (which could have been a doomed ending but does not have a doomed ending and thus avoids being a cliche ).

        Tauriel was ruined and she deserved better and I wanted much much more for her. I also do not want to hate her for the mistakes the writers made but I can’t help but start being annoyed the moment she shows up and starts talking because she and her romance with Kili ruines everything great about Aragorn/Arwen and Legolas and Gimli. And it’s not even done in a good way. (Like if your going to ruin the meaning of those 2 relationships, at least do it in a good way so write a believable well paced mature romance that stays true to elven and dwarfisg natures….but nooo. cliche instand love, and everything already said before in the artikle was instead done. So now they not only ruined 2 very well written and devolped relationships, they did so withoud giving us another well written relationship in return…like if I ever would get the one ring and go evil and corrupted on the world, I would take my sweet time taking revange on the people who’s brilliant idea it was to write that romance,,with those characters…in that way..)

        Poor awesome Tauriel that could have been. RIP.
        Poor well written romance with appropriate characters (no she-elves!)that could have been. Rip
        Poor Kili/Fili brother screen time that could have been. RIP
        Poor fun simple cute/funny obvious friends only relationship between Legolas and Tauriel that could have been. Rip

        Also lack of Thranduil Tauriel scenes that where not about dwarves/romantic feelings is an ishue. He either talks to her about how she can not be with Legolas or “give him hope when there is none“ or her weird speach about how Thranduil does not know love (after living with him for 600 years you’d think she’d know her own specie (and king) well enough to know he did love, (elves only have 1 love in their immortal lives and Thranduil having had a wife and havinf a son and al that…kinda obvious in your face hints he did love and that is from a mortal human who saw Thranduil for like minutes and read a little about elves here and there, she saw him for 600 years and IS and elf..I mean come on how could she possible have missed that he did felt love)

        I btw have a love/hate relationship with Thranduils: because it was real.

        why I Hate it: because there is no way that love between people who just met and devolped so forcedin the matter of days (maybe weeks? Like how much hours where they actually in the same places?) and randomly felt in any way believable in enough to be “real“

        How I cope with that: I’m just going with Thranduil being a father like figure who depsite the arguemnts and rift of earlyer cares deeply for Tauriel and wanting to ease Tauriels pain by telling her it was real, instead of telling her it wasn’t real which would only make her grow upset more regardless if it is true or not. It would make the rift between them bigger instead of bring them back together. And if we stick by the info they gave us of her, she is favord by Thranduil so he obviously cares about her. Maybe he cares for her like an adopted daughter or something.If this is true then it’s possible he feels bad for the rift that was between them, and is pained by her tears regardless where they come from and he wishes to mend the bonds and end the fights and have her come back home where she belongs (especially now Legolas is not comming back home which gives him even more reason to behave in such a way that makes Tauriel feel understood and welcome to come home again)Thats how I now see Thranduil’s words considering Tauriel’s situation. he is just being like the good/cool dad/wise elf king and making up for their strife earlyer. so it’s not crazy to imagine he regrets having had that fight with her and is willing to forgive her and also willing to overlook what happend because she has been punnished enough by losing Kili and he would like for her to come home and heal both for her sake and for his own so he wont have to deal with losing both Tauriel and Legolas at the same time….but maybe I’m just making to much up to be able to deal with it’s meaning towards Tauriel :P)

        Why I Love it: It gives us one of the most open and emotional vurnable moments of Thranduil. the one moment he obviously shows he DID love and lost that love in Legolas his mother. Ok I got that earlyr and some other people might as well. But this moment does say so the most.

        So yeah. I try to see this moment, and focus only on the beauty that must have been Thranduil x his wife (who probably shared hundreds if not thousends of years together) opposed to the cliche badly written Tauriel/Kili romance that made just no sense, not even in a normal romantic way if you ignore their spiecy background. And I try to see this scene as Thranduil trying to mend the bonds torn by pride(yes stolen from Brave 😛 ) between him and Tauriel by giving her pain meaning and making her feel he understands her. Even if maybe he doesn’t fully agree, or feels his love was much more real then hers, saying that to somebody who is grieving is a bad idea if you wish to connect to somebody again. Thranduil is being the better wiser guy here, and not making it a competition and will admit she felt something, that she believes was real. Even if it wasn’t real, if she believes it was that is all that matters in such a moment.

        So when thinking that, It makes Thranduil seem even more awesome :) So thats how I now see that scene. Sadly I do not have similar coping mechanisms for all other Kili Tauriel related things…if you have any please share :) (or anyone else for that matter)

      • I really like what you wrote about Thranduil’s line. I’m totally digging what you said and I would really love it for the ways you portrayed it if, IF it wasn’t overshadowed by that damned love story. There’s just no way I get over that to appreciate the underlying meaning. So unfortunately, I can’t share any coping mechanisms. I have to find my own ways of coping first but I guess that’ll take a lot of time.

        Talking about Thranduil and his wife – at least we got these amazing cosplayers who were just pure joy to watch at the world premiere. They were perfect!

  • THIS.
    Except maybe that: „ultimately becoming the most irritating character in the Middle-earth movie franchise.“ That’ll always be Thorin, for me. xD
    But seriously. I hadn’t even minded that Tauriel and Kíli were to fall in love because I still – foolishly – thought that this wouldn’t be the ONLY thing for Tauriel. I guess there’s still a summer child in me …
    You know what I hated the most about the third movie? Not only did they turn her into a mere love interest, they got her to be a damsel in distress fucking twice, to be rescued by both dudes (and finding a way to kill off one of them). That’s where I started eye-rolling.

    It’s sad, really, considering how proud PJ and others involved in the movies were. I’d really like to have a private chat about that with them … Then again, I’m used to being disappointed by what Tolkien/PJ do to their female characters, just look as Éowyn. Another warrior, and what happens in the end? She realises she’s not so much into fighting after all and would rather be the equivalent of a nurse. If you take into account Tolkien’s WWI background: it was perfectly fine for women to be nurses at the front lines because they were still exerting those ‚female qualities‘ of caring (for men). But fighting as soldiers? Nah. And that’s what I see in Éowyn, and I hate that. (And I hate me a little bit for hating her character for loving Aragorn when I first watched the movies as a kid.) So, yeah, it’s not as if Tauriel’s fate is anything new (though Éowyn still had more of an actual story line), it’s just really, really disappointing and tiring.

    • Well, Thorin’s an ass most of the time, but an ass that looks like Richard Armitage, soooo … ;P . I totally understand why you dislike him and I don’t quite like him either but I find him to be an interesting character. And I cried anyways.
      Maybe I could have lived with it, too, if the whole thing had been much more reasonable and believable, but we’ll never know. I forgot (or rather, I didn’t want to remember) the damsel in distress parts. Should have made my list, too.

      You’re right about Éowyn. Therefore, I really liked that Galadriel got some action to show off, since she was so passive in LotR. I just hate that the Gandalf and Galadriel friendship was a little over the top and seemed like there’s something going on between them.

      • I don’t care what he looks like. xD (And, tbh, I don’t find Richard Armitage that attractive, really.) And I also didn’t cry, but had more to do with the general awfulness of the last part of the movie. (I’m also slightly annoyed that next to Kíli and Thorin, Fìli’s death is … I don’t know, swept under the rug?)

        I really liked that, too! Though, I was a bit bewildered why she just sat there for a large part of the scene. I mean … she could have done something. xD
        It’s good that you mentioned that. I genuinely thought there was something more going on.

      • I just totally love him in North & South. Ohhh, his hangdog look 😀 !
        Gosh, I was soooo mad about Fili’s death scene! He really didn’t deserve this. Why couldn’t we have what’s actually in the book: Fili and Kili fighting to protect Thorin and dying side by side. That would have been emotional.

        Can’t remember it that well, but wasn’t she drained or something? Didn’t it take her last ounce of strength to fight back? Or was that sitting around before that?

        And that’s totally bullshit. I mean, Gandalf’s basically an angel or lesser God or whatever the Istari were (yeah, we definitely have to read The Silmarillion) and Galadriel has been happily married for millennia.

      • Oh, well, tastes. xD I’ve just seen pictures and … nopenopenope.
        I didn’t even need the book version, just … I don’t not. Just not what we actually got.

        That was before that. She frees Gandalf and carries him to the centre of the platform, and than she just sits there, talkes with Dark Dude #1, then they bring on what-was-those-ghost-kings-name-again, she makes her „Who said I came alone“ (or something like that) remark and keeps just sitting there while Saruman and Elrond merrily battle around her; and then it’s Dard Dude Overlord’s time to take the stage, she drives him away, and that drains her. At least that’s how I remember it. xD But there was definitely some sitting around before Sauron appeared.

        Even those need some love in their life, and there’s still that thing calles polyamory. xD But considering those are Tolkien’s character, it is indeed bullshit.

    • I fully agree about Thorin being a dislikable character, but somehow he still became one of my fave characters in the hobbit movies because he was one of the more interesting and more devolped ones. Perhaps this would have been different if the other dwarves had gotten more to do/say and more devolpment.

      I am very very upset with how Fili’s death happend (but I am upset about Fili was treated period. Despite his terrible treatment, he did get some strong moments and was shown to be a strong character. I hated the way he died and was unable to cry because of how pissed I was. But I can apriciate that when looking at it again, he makes Kili move away from the noise (away from the danger) like a good older brother would, and that he uses his last breath to tell the others to run (no begging for his life or scared screaming for help stuff). But still…he deserved so much more.

      Kili’s death equaly terrible. I was actually happy when he died because it ment the terrible romance would be over and I would not longer have to watch Tauriel in damsel in distress/irrationaly deep in unbelievable fast way in love mode.

      Thorin’s death I did cry, but not because of Thorin, but because of the emotion of Bilbo and his pain. I love Bilbo. I felt terrible for him.

      I was botherd by Galadriels scene for 2 reasons. Her power against Sauron should have been more WHITE. She got dark in lord of the rings because of the dark temptation of the ring. But at the end of the day she is the lady of light….LIGHT people. Not seaweed. SO yeah awesome plus points for her being bamf for a moment, but I disliked that they used her one ring moment look. (Which in turn takes away from the impact of that moment)

      Her laying and sitting so much during the scene also botherd me especialy because her entrance was bamf too. Then she like just collapsed, and had to be protected untill she was ready to face Sauron and then she was like behold I’m the evil seawitch! Except I’m not evil lol. And then she collapses again. I’m fine with that final collapse, she did a huge thing there. But the rest bugged me. I still think she is THE awesome lady of middle earth though.

      • You’re so right about Fili. I think in the bigger picture, the first one’s the best of the movies because it really was about Bilbo and the dwarves. I was so sad that the individual dwarves had so little screentime in the following movies when it was supposed to be all about them and Bilbo (I also think that Bilbo hadn’t enough screentime and that’s really bad considering the whole thing’s called THE HOBBIT).

        Right, I was wondering about that, too, but pushed it back since I was just so glad she got something cool to do.

    • As for Eowyn. Flawed as it might be, I keep in mind she was written in a time where the mere idea of fighting woman was unheard of. Which means that for that time Tolkien did an awesome thing for woman. He was actually pretty modern in that light. Galadriel being so importand and powerfull. Eowyn playing a big part in the death of one of the biggest bad guys. Thats all very awesome, especialy for that time.

      Also I did not get the feeling she stopped wanting to fight. I got the feeling she simply understood the terror of war better. Like any person would after their first battle. I daubt any person would walk away after their first battle just peachy and ready for more. if you have heart, you will have problems with it. Also She was still injured when the final battle happend so we don’t really know what she would have done after her healing (in the movies anyway),if the war with Sauron was still going on then. Faramir also didn’t fight.

      She was a pretty realistic, ahead of her time woman. Written in a time not pro fighting woman. Which means tolkien was ahead of his time with that as well.

      And the movie version to me does not dissapoint. her love towards Aragorn is sweet, (or a bit annoying to each their own) but never forced. And she does get over him when he is clear about his own heart. (Thank you Aragorn for doing what many in the center of triangle do not) She also does not act like a jelous annoying girl. She acts like a mature woman who just happens to have feelings for a man that did not love her, but did respect her and she found love elsewhere and probably became friends with him. Also the romantic bits where not her main story, just parts of it. Her main moment was completely devoid of anything romantic. She defeated the witch king (with Merry’s help, a hobbit), she had a touching sad moment with her uncle, and then a beautifful heartbreaking scene when Eomer finds her and thinks her dead. Kick ass, and family emotion.

      Also even if that had been handeld in a terrible way, there is just one bamf moment that makes up for everything.

      Witch king: “No man can kill me“
      Eowyn: Takes of helmet “ I am no Man.“ (I can almost picture the witch king pulling a face like oh crap)

      BAMF! Awesome. She just defeated one of the biggest bad guys people. In fact she defeats the biggest one that has an actual form on the battle field. (Sauron being an eye and all that) Not counting Smaug because he is not in lord of the rings.

      BUt I agree that I expected much more from Tauriel considering she is created by modern people in a modern time. There is enoug desire for a warrior woman withoud any romance. They do not have the exuse of Tolkien of living in a more old fashiond time. If they where going to create a warrior woman of their own, they should have done so in such a way that it removoves the romance all together. No that would have been a statment.

      nothing against romance. Love is a beautifull magical thing. But it’s not a woman thing. It’s ok to write romance in a different way for once. Do not a female character if your only going to turn her into a love sick teenager like character…

      • I’d like to disagree here. Éowyn definitely has BAMF moments, and the way her romance is handled was rather good, as I came to realise after I matured a bit. :)

        But I wouldn’t say Tolkien was ahead of his time. He did serve in WWI, and so did women – they’ve been nurses, they’ve been soldiers (though to a much, much lesser extent as people obviously didn’t like that much), they’ve been workers at home and did all the jobs men couldn’t do in their absence etc. (Same with WWII.) And people were aware of that, they just didn’t like it. As I said, her transformation from a warrior to nurse depicts, for me, this general realization back then, that, sure, women could do a man’s work, but they shouldn’t, they’re better in caring positions – „it’s in their nature“. And I doubt that Tolkien shied away from that thought, because he was a rather sexist man indeed. That was a general thing back then (even more so than today), true, but as the saying goes: it’s your own responsibility to be better than your times, and I will hold him accountable for not doing that. Not that he would mind much. 😉

        Now, of course the war would have to have some sort of effect on her, on everybody. You’re perfectly right with that. It’s just as I said – he chose that stereotypical path that reflects those stereotypical notions about women back then, and that bothers me.
        She could have developed into many directions, but that she completely gives up her live-long dream … it’s one option, sure. But all things considered, I have the feeling that this was the ONLY option he saw for her. I still love her, though, but maybe that’s why I think she derserved better treatment than she got in the end. :) (That is not to disregard her achievements and her important role.)

        Totally agree with what you say about Tauriel, though. I’m so tired of women being equated with romance of some sort, as if we’d need it like air to breathe.
        Also, they did not only have to do that, but also with the most obvious choice. Of course it had to be the youngest hot dwarf, because people can’t root for potentially less attractive poeple’s romance. :(

      • Oh! „I still love her, though, but maybe that’s why I think she derserved better treatment than she got in the end.“
        That was not to say that anyone who doesn’t think that way doesn’t love her, btw. Just realised that that sentence might be misunderstood. :/

  • Not to mention she must be the dumbest and most easily distracted character in the movie. For the captain of the royal guard she needs everything explained to her by Legolas and is she really wanting to save the world or is she just selfishly driven by her personal feelings for a single dwarf? She should have just been a bad ass fighter and maybe throw in a romantic storyline with Legolas which his father forbids. The whole Kili deal was just too much.

    • I dont hate her character or the actress however. Lily performed as well as could be expected given the awkward storyline.

    • True, I’m wondering how she got that position in the first place since she’s so young. I can’t believe there are no other elves that are as capable with weapons but older and wiser.

      Ahhh, well, I thought about this and hesitated to include it as a positive aspect. In the end, I decided that it couldn’t be just for Kili’s sake. If I remember correctly, there’s this scene when she talks to Thrandi about the spiders and wants to leave the elven realm to drive them back once and for all instead of just protecting the borders. That has nothing to do with Kili at all so I’d say she wants to better the world.

      Depending on how that would have been handled, it could also have taken away from her badassness. However, I guess it would have been the lesser of two evils.